Previous | Memories | Share | Next
 
Jo
canadiangirl_86
[sasa_hq]
11 October 2007 @ 01:55 pm
S4 Spoiler and Spec Thread!  
First off, I've been a completely absentee mod yet again, and I apologize for that!

Second, I'm sure by now we've all seen and freaked out over the brand spankin' new S4 teaser trailer. 2008 can't get here fast enough! So to keep up the hype, I thought we could have a thread devoted to analyzing any spoilers we've got and spec on Kara and Lee for the final season. This can include them as a couple or their separate journeys throughout the season.

DO NOT LOOK UNDER THE CUT if you've been avoiding spoilers. If you'd like a separate thread for the spoilerphobes which can be for pure speculation on the final season, let me know and if the crowd is substantial enough we can do that too or instead.

The following excellent spoiler round-up is re-posted with the permission of [info]wisteria_. It involves all the characters but it could be key to accurate speculation for Kara and Lee! I'll highlight stuff that I think may be important.

Episode titles:

4.01-4.02 - "Razor" (I really hope the numbering isn't screwy again this year.)
4.03 - "He Who Believeth In Me"
4.04 - "Six of One"
4.05 - "The Ties That Bind"
4.06 - "Escape Velocity"
4.07 - "Into the West"
4.08 - "Faith"


General stuff:
  • They might find Earth sooner than everyone thinks. Some of the actors have hinted that the "Earth" they find might not be our planet.

  • Tyrol is not dealing well with the Cylon reveal. At one point, he shaves his head.

  • Lots of (unconfirmed?) speculation that Cally dies early in the season.

  • Aaron Douglas at Dragon*Con: "We're Cylons, and we have been from the start" was also filmed as "since the beginning." The distinction is important.

  • During the blogger press day video interview, Douglas said that his character was "one of the Cylon gods", though it's unclear whether or not this was a joke.

  • "Head Baltar" was cast for episode 4, possibly as a stand-in.

  • At some point right after the season ended (can't find the source), Katee said that "Starbuck as we know her is dead and gone."

  • Nana Visitor will guest-star in episode 6, playing a fellow cancer patient who befriends Roslin during treatment.


LA Times web chat with Sackhoff:
  • There will be a lot more of Kara and Leoben, but she doesn't know which version of Leoben it will be.

  • Roslin and Kara have some interaction, though it won't be very positive. She might try to airlock Kara. They have a competitive vibe.

  • Kara will be going off on her own this year.

  • "I'm not a Cylon, you bitch!"

  • She thinks Kara loves Sam, but that it's "over". She sees Kara and Lee as "soulmates". She implied that Lee and Dee are completely done.


Sackhoff on the "Cort & Fatboy" radio show:
  • Kara does have a pivotal role near the end of "Razor", and it has something to with the Cylons.

  • She has heard a rumor of who the last Cylon might be, but she suspects "it's just a big huge lie, because if this person really is the Fifth, then it's a really bad move, in my opinion."

  • "There are definitely moments where Adama tries to kick my ass."


Ask Ausiello, 09.26.07:
  • He did an asterisk quiz. Someone on the TWOP boards interpreted it as this: "Kara Thrace will lead the (human/Cylon) race to its end. She is the (bearer/mother/source) of the apocalypse, the (destroyer/protector) of Earth. They must not follow her."


Blog Talk Radio, August 2007:
  • At some point, Adama is very pissed off and decides to take Kara's "pristine" viper out for a spin.

  • "When [Kara] comes back she's going to be put in... a jail cell because they are not quite sure whether she's a Cylon or what, but a few episodes in there going to be a hostage scene where she basically breaks out of prison and is holding President Roslin at gunpoint." Tigh, with a contingent of Marines, is ordered to "save the president at all costs, no matter what the fallout is."


SciFi Pulse's "The Women of BSG" video:
  • Roslin doesn't know that Tory is a Cylon.

  • There is a new version of Six, called Natalie.

  • Caprica Six is going in an interesting direction and "sort of falls in love, and it's NOT Baltar." Photos of Helfer and Trucco on her blog suggest that the man might be Anders.


Ausiello again, via SyFy Portal:
  • "Let's go with BSG. As Syfyportal.com already reported, three humanoid Cylon models will be completely wiped out next season. Well, I just found out (Spoiler alert) which ones are getting retired, and I can tell you they all have one thing in common: their gender. And here's another tasty morsel: the name of the 13th Colony in the Colonial Scriptures? 'Cylon.'"


SpaceCast's behind-the-scenes video featurette:
  • The actors are filming a scene on Colonial One. Lee's wearing a suit, and he has just finished a press conference. Roslin stands to the side and applauds.


Sackhoff at Polaris Con:
  • Lucy Lawless will return.

  • When asked if she'd be kicking ass in a viper this season, Katee said, "Not as much as last year. But I kick ass everywhere."

  • Starbuck points a gun at someone and kills two Marines.

  • Starbuck shoots cylons (in a viper).

  • Starbuck has sex and gets drunk.

  • They might find Earth sooner than we think.

  • A lot of division in the coming season, with loyalties where you might not expect them.

  • There's a brothel - obviously this is Baltar's harem that was mentioned online before. Katee jokingly said Starbuck's a regular visitor.


The "Blogger Press Day":
  • "Behind the main Basestar set was a conference room, but as production designer Richard Hudolin informed, it was all a well kept secret for Season 4, "We can only walk you past the other room because it's a hot set. It was shot up the other day and for continuity, you can only walk by it. You'll see the red eye stretches wall to wall." Like he said, we see the red line spanning the length of the wall, as well as several off-set whites square lights. More noticeable, however, is the fact that it looks as though several automatic rifles have been fired in the room, as support beams have gaping holes and chunks of concrete (or some Cylon equivalent) line the floor. Whoever was at this end of the conference room had a rough scene to film, though no hint was given as to who it might have been."

  • "During the visit to the Cylon control room, it was said that filming had just finished on a battle sequence on another Cylon set for episode 4 of Season 4. Press tour members were led through a Cylon conference room where an explosion had occurred, and where the walls were filled with bullet holes. The scene was also spattered in blood. Apparently the sequence involves a sort of mini-rebellion with Cylon centurions gaining intelligence and rebelling against their human masters. In Season 4, according to those on the set, it will be revealed that the centurion models are capable of intelligent thought, but the human form Cylons have been suppressing that ability with a device implanted in the positronic brain of the Cylon's that prevents them from reasoning, and keeps them passive. No one would go into further details, but apparently a number of Centurions have these devices removed, and the battle damaged set is the result of the confrontation between these Centurions and their human form Cylon Masters. From the debris scattered about, the numerous bullet holes in the walls, and the shattered glass of the conference room, it would appear that the Centurions are not very happy about being enslaved by these human Cylon masters, much as their ancestors were enslaved by the humans, which led to the first Cylon war."

  • "Also of note from the set was the existence of a brand new viper model, briefly seen at the end of the Season 3 finale, and flown by Starbuck upon her return from the dead. This new viper has apparently been totally rebuilt, much to the dismay of the fleet, which leads to speculation from the other characters that Starbuck is in fact a Cylon."


EntWkly interview with Hogan and Sackhoff:
  • HOGAN: I have scenes with [Cylon] Number Six in [the first season four] episode, and I'm really looking forward to playing them. Tigh's going to be very curious to have meetings with her now. I'm going to want something completely different out of her.


Pittsburgh Post-Gazette interview with RDM the day after 3.20 aired:
  • We're developing a storyline dealing with D'Anna and what she saw and who she was talking to. We haven't talked to [Lucy Lawless] about it and she was just cast in a pilot, which makes it tricky. But it's something we would like to look at.

  • Regarding "Razor": There is a tie from these episodes into the events in season four. ... It's an opportunity to set up something for the fourth season that had not been told to the audience and that the characters themselves hadn't realized, and then go into the fourth season.

  • [Season 4 is] about new alliances and broken alliances among the panoply of our characters within the rag tag fleet and without. Different allegiances in terms of loyalties, relationships broken and some new ones formed. All the pieces line up in different ways than they have heretofore.
SPOILER ADDITIONS

  • According to some of the K/L shippers at the SciFi Forums - and hopefully they won't be upset that I'm reposting this - Katee recently said at the Chicago convention that one word to describe K and L's journey in the final season is "closure". She then allegedly giggled and said to take that any way we'd like
  • In addition, Katee said that Kara's journey with Lee is "pretty much over"
    • ETA: a more detailed con report is located here and may shed some more light on where Katee's coming from. Don't despair!
  • I also wanted to add that during the Polaris con back in July, Katee was discussing practical jokes on set and mentioned almost handcuffing Bamber to a bed during a sex scene. This is not a spoiler per se, just my own gut feeling that this is a new tidbit of info from filming the last season.
  • Added Nov 1, 2007 - from TWOP:
    • Another 'Cult Times' interview, this time with Michael Trucco. Season 4 spoilers,.....

      He becomes a viper pilot (how does he fit in the plane?)

      When Starbuck returns.... " Starbuck thinks she's only been gone 6 hours, but in our world it's 2 months" "Lee grabs her first and gives her this big bear hug, and the Anders comes up to her and he's got tears of joy in his eyes. Of course Starbuck is confused and is like 'Hey, what the hell is going on?'.
      The joy, however that Anders feels at having his wife back is then instantly replaced with fear. He's wondering 'Does she recognise I'm a cylon? Do I want her to recognize that? Do I want to tip her off?"
      "At the same time Anders is sort of given the task by the other three,Tigh, Tori and Tyrol to pick Kara's brain for information. What does she know? What happened to her when she was gone?" ....
      "Katee and I then had another great scene where Anders basically tells Starbuck, 'No matter what happened to you, no matter who you are, even if you were a cylon, I'd still love you'. Sadly her response isn't quite what he's hoping for" jokes the actor. "So their relationship has become strained to say the least, and it continues to be so throughout the early part of season four"
QUESTIONS
  • From the hug we see in the S4 teaser, Lee is very happy to see Kara. Will it last? We don't see him in any of the other little clips, around Kara, protecting Kara from those accusing her of being a cylon (including Daddy Adama from the looks of it). Is he forcibly separated from her or does he change his mind about what she is?
  • Adding to these questions, we see Lee in a suit on Colonial One in some unidentified footage from S4. Roslin stands next to him and applauds a speech he makes. What role is he playing and do we think it's connected to Kara? Bamber implied at a recent con that he and Roslin are on very bad terms, so how can we explain this?
  • Bamber also stated that Lee is supposedly at a stage of "mutual respect" with his father at some point in the season. Are he and Adama then both supporting Kara? Does this mean Adama goes against his sweetheart, Roslin, after initially suspecting Kara?
  • Katee says Kara finds "closure" with Lee and that her journey with him is "over". What does this mean? Do they simply come to a place of peace between the two of them or will they be separated for good? How does this tie in with Katee's declaration that Kara and Lee are "soulmates"?
    • this mod is speculating that they have The Sex for The Closure, and Kara lets Lee go for the sake of her mission. Why that may be is obviously anybody's guess
  • Kara looks almost sad when she hugs Lee in the trailer. We saw perhaps a hint of this sadness when she greets him at the end of Crossroads II. Does she suspect what lies ahead for her or is it something specifically having to do with Lee?
  • What do we think Sam's intention is in telling Kara, "If you're a cylon, then you've been one from the beginning"? Is he trying to comfort her or is he trying to find a real point of connection between them so they can live happily ever after?
  • Who will side with Kara and who will betray her?
    • From Tahmoh's comments at the Chicago con, I would guess that Helo will back Kara up, along with Tigh and most likely Anders. Will the shocking and ironic betrayal be Sharon?
  • We have so little info on Lee. WHY?!
  • Is Kara the final cylon? Is Lee? Are their destinies at all connected? Past signs point to YES but who knows.
Tags: , , ,
 
22 fell | fall off the wagon
 
( 22 fell — fall off the wagon )
croakvegas: Lee[info]croakvegas on October 11th, 2007 06:46 pm (UTC)
EXCELLENT. Thanks for putting that all together!

I have no constructive speculation to offer at the moment, my head's still spinning from the promo video (and I watched that like 3 days ago, LOL) but I figure we've still got plenty of time to hypothesise...
Jo: it's alright [kara/lee][info]canadiangirl_86 on October 12th, 2007 02:41 am (UTC)
No problem. All the italicized spoilers were put together by [info] though so we should all thank her! :D

...but I figure we've still got plenty of time to hypothesise...

True. Maybe we should pace ourselves. 2008 is a looong time from now.
Allison: home[info]frolicndetour on October 11th, 2007 07:08 pm (UTC)
I'm not reading this because I'm trying to stick to promo-type spoilers and stuff the actors let slip. I know with actors like Aaron Douglas and Katee Sackhoff I might as well just go all the way and spoiler-whore it up, but I'd vote for a thread with just "lite" spoilers like 'x happened in the promo' or Katee said "y" at a convention/interview, as opposed to "Character Z dies" (yeah, still mad that I know that. *snarl*) - if anyone else has an nterest in that.
Jo: first kiss - [scar][info]canadiangirl_86 on October 12th, 2007 02:33 am (UTC)
If it's cool with you I'm just gonna wait another day or so to see if anyone else wants a spoiler-free thread. But also to let you know, the majority of the spoilers in this thread are of the "Katee said this at the convention" variety. *G* Really not too many hardcore spoilers out yet!
Allison: k/l boxing[info]frolicndetour on October 12th, 2007 04:12 am (UTC)
Heh. I broke. I still haven't read the post but figure you guys will mostly be discussing the K/L spoilers and not who dies or who's Cylon #5. Er, right? ;) I think I already know all the K/L ones.

ANYWAY. Like you, I'm not too worried about the "closure" comment in and of itself because she's said that before, and because she tends to go along with wherever her character is in the moment. Right now they're about halfway through filming, right? So it wouldn't surprise me if they're apart midseason. But, I am somewhat worried and I'll just give y'all my list of reasons why, heh:

-Katee says that her character has sex in the early episodes (I'm assuming that's 4.0 and not Razor, b/c Razor was pre-UB and before she rescued Sam.) But Jamie says that Lee hasn't had sex in forever. So if Kara's not having sex with Lee, then who? I don't think it's Sam b/c she's said that they're over. So... Leoben? (Ugh.)

- Katee also said that her character was moving beyond the point where love for any one particular person was appropriate, because she has a "higher purpose." Since you guys are the spoiler-hos, I'll tell you that she's also pushing for her character to die again because she doesn't think she can ever be happy, so sort of as a mercy killing. She ALSO said that at the end of the series, Kara will have "found peace." That makes me suspect that she knows how her character will end up, so anything she's saying now may be more or less the endgame.

- I don't know what to think about Jamie's dissatisfaction because at comic-con, someone asked Ron who had the most exciting storyline and he said probably Baltar and Six, but Lee was a close second and the writers could never have predicted where he'd end up. Hmmm. And Bop-Radar also said that he always sounds dissatisfied with his storylines midseason, so, maybe that's it?

-But whenever anyone asks him about K/L he's just like "Thank god the show's almost over, it's just the same thing over and over." Which... sounds like this season is going to be more of the same as far as they're concerned, which I would personally find very frustrating because hello, she died. Shoudn't that be a game-changer?

-Combine that with the fact that Katee's saying "please, just kill me already, put me out of my misery" makes me think that it's going to be more "they try to get together but they can't because Kara's too damaged." Now, I never wanted Kara to get "Cordelia Chased," but to me that really undermines what her character went through in Maelstrom, if she comes back (from death!) exactly the same. It also undermines Lee's realization that trying to get over her showed him he needed to be with her. So again, what was the point? I thought Michael Angeli said that Kara was the love of Lee's life and next season they were going to get back to that. (Heh. I was all, "The Woman King:Forgiven!")

Arg. I think that's all my depressingness for now. I'm starting to think they can just take all the time they want with the last season, AFAIC. Meh. *sulks*
Jo: katee will beat you down[info]canadiangirl_86 on October 12th, 2007 04:45 am (UTC)
Inter-mah-resting.

Where'd Jamie say that he hasn't been having sex on the show lately? I sort of recall something joke-y to that effect at Dragon*Con but I don't remember the details. Then again, Jamie can keep a secret and Katee can't so I refuse to give up on my spec of hot pilot sex! You can't make me!! :P

That makes me suspect that she knows how her character will end up, so anything she's saying now may be more or less the endgame.

Hmm. The more she details the end for Starbuck, the less I think it'll end up that way. It's very possible that Moore and Katee have discussed the general notion that Starbuck will be at peace by the end, but if they've decided to kill her off, I highly doubt Katee would be talking about it so openly. At least I would hope not.

But whenever anyone asks him about K/L he's just like "Thank god the show's almost over, it's just the same thing over and over." Which... sounds like this season is going to be more of the same as far as they're concerned, which I would personally find very frustrating because hello, she died. Shoudn't that be a game-changer?

This I find to be a stumper, because Jamie also said that the relationship between Kara and Lee has "definitely changed". Hummina?!

So many contradictions, it's driving me insane.
Allison: Katee[info]frolicndetour on October 12th, 2007 05:16 am (UTC)
I just read a con-report, so maybe something was lost in translation. But what I read was that at some point he says (at dragon con) that he hadn't been laid if forever and Aaron was like "dude, you've got three kids!" and he clarified that he meant that Lee hadn't been laid in forever. But yeah, the "closure" comment with the flirty head-toss and the "take that how you will" definitely made me think naked closure. :D Though I don't know if I really want it to be closure...

It's very possible that Moore and Katee have discussed the general notion that Starbuck will be at peace by the end, but if they've decided to kill her off, I highly doubt Katee would be talking about it so openly

I really hope you're right! I just don't know, though, she sucks at keeping secrets (said with affection!), and Ron + Co might have just given up on that score given the eternal wait betwen filming and broadcast of the season. But I do hope you're right!

This I find to be a stumper, because Jamie also said that the relationship between Kara and Lee has "definitely changed". Hummina?!

Oh, you know I had forgotten that one. Hmmm! Well, now I just don't know what to think. *boggles*
starringsarah[info]starringsarah on October 11th, 2007 08:30 pm (UTC)
Why do I read Katee interviews? Why?

I really hope that closure stuff is Katee screwing with us, because I want payoff BSG, not alas we can never be, THE END. And I had enough of Kara and Lee in separate stories in S3, thank you very much. I want them interacting regularly this last season. Also, why end S3 with Kara coming back to Lee, and not the fleet, if it is over for them? I'm beginning to think the writers are bored with them (and can't write a romantic relationship), and want to write for all the new characters instead.

I fear we're hearing nothing about Lee because there is nothing to be heard. The writers have always had trouble finding things for him to do, and now that he's no longer military, he's even more cutoff from the main action. Or his part of the action doesn't pick up until the second half of S4, in 2009.

Well, that effectively ruined my S4 promo high.
statua gentilissima[info]queenofthorns on October 11th, 2007 08:59 pm (UTC)

I fear we're hearing nothing about Lee because there is nothing to be heard.

This is what I fear too. And I don't think the writers are bored with Kara, because it sounds like there's lots of stuff for her but I do think they might be bored with the Lee/Kara relationship (which, frankly, HAD achieved closure until she came back from the dead!)
starringsarah[info]starringsarah on October 11th, 2007 09:35 pm (UTC)
And I don't think the writers are bored with Kara, because it sounds like there's lots of stuff for her

I did mean specifically they were bored with the Kara/Lee relationship, but since they have never actually had an exclusive relationship, I think closure at this point is a copout. Besides, it's not as if they plan on making them best friends again either.

As for the stuff with Kara, well I do remember Katee complaining that she didn't have much to do early on, but it's not the same as the complete silence about Lee. Still, special destiny girl has never been my favourite flavour of Starbuck, so I hope I don't end up cringing through this entire storyline.
Jo: jamie[info]canadiangirl_86 on October 12th, 2007 02:38 am (UTC)
...but I do think they might be bored with the Lee/Kara relationship (which, frankly, HAD achieved closure until she came back from the dead!)

Grr, I certainly hope not! It seemed to me like they were doing so much set up at the end of S3 for some monumental payoff in S4. I really hope the writers don't let us down now.
statua gentilissima: BSG - Lee - mutinies[info]queenofthorns on October 12th, 2007 02:43 am (UTC)
I KNOW! It certainly seems like they're setting Lee and Kara up as this huge thing (not even necessarily a huge ROMANTIC thing, but this way that, as Katee says, they're "soulmates" - even though I hate that word.)

But then I also thought that they were setting up Lee to have a role in the Presidential elections storyline in s2 and I was so wrong about that! :(
Jo: hold onto me[info]canadiangirl_86 on October 12th, 2007 02:36 am (UTC)
See, I was initially bummed about her comments but then I think back to what she said about Scar before it aired. I don't know if you remember but she flat out said that she thought that after that episode the door would be closed forever for Kara and Lee. She was...pretty wrong about that one. *G*

Also, the fact that she was kinda giggling when she said "closure" makes me think there's definitely more to it. Maybe they won't have much interaction during the season, which will suck for sure, but maybe what does happen between them will be meaningful enough to last us for a while.

At least I hope.

I fear we're hearing nothing about Lee because there is nothing to be heard. The writers have always had trouble finding things for him to do, and now that he's no longer military, he's even more cutoff from the main action. Or his part of the action doesn't pick up until the second half of S4, in 2009.

All true. :/ I'm worried about Lee.
starringsarah[info]starringsarah on October 12th, 2007 03:14 am (UTC)
See, I was initially bummed about her comments but then I think back to what she said about Scar before it aired

I do remember the Scar stuff. But this is the last season. There's not a lot to time to fix this dammit. And I've always been much more interested in the LKAR relationships on BSG than mystical flights of destiny and special cylon revelations. Besides, post Scar we got the alternaships. I'm afraid what they could do to separate pilots this time.

The giggling could be re: the specced goodbye/breakup sex. Which seems like Kara, but not like Lee.
statua gentilissima: BSG - Laura - thoughtful[info]queenofthorns on October 11th, 2007 08:57 pm (UTC)
Starbuck has sex and gets drunk.

Heh! I feel that this maybe doesn't qualify as a spoiler :P Seeing as it has happened, what, every season?

We have so little info on Lee. WHY?!

The cynic in me says ... because Lee doesn't have much to do this season - as per Dragon Con reports?
Jo: need part II [kara/lee][info]canadiangirl_86 on October 12th, 2007 02:39 am (UTC)
Heh! I feel that this maybe doesn't qualify as a spoiler :P Seeing as it has happened, what, every season?

Wow, good point. *G*

The cynic in me says ... because Lee doesn't have much to do this season - as per Dragon Con reports?

But since Ron Moore seems to be excited about Lee's storyline, let's just hope that his stuff picks up massively in the latter half of the season. *crosses fingers*
statua gentilissima[info]queenofthorns on October 12th, 2007 02:44 am (UTC)
since Ron Moore seems to be excited about Lee's storyline, let's just hope that his stuff picks up massively in the latter half of the season.

I hope that's "excited in a good way" and not "excited in a 'Woman King' way" :P Now I'm bitter that we'll have to probalby wait until 2009 to see the good stuff, though!
Jo: maxim [katee][info]canadiangirl_86 on October 12th, 2007 02:46 am (UTC)
I hope that's "excited in a good way" and not "excited in a 'Woman King' way"

LMFAO. Dude, you're killing my optimism here. Just GO WITH IT.
statua gentilissima: BSG - lee/kara - trapped[info]queenofthorns on October 12th, 2007 02:47 am (UTC)
Hee! I'm sorry - I do NOT want to kill your optimism at all. The good thing for me is that by the time this airs, I will TOTALLY have forgotten the spoilers and I'll be excited about the show again :P

(And I will say that I was totally bummed about "Unfinished Business" spoilers and it ended up possibly being my favorite episode of last season! So I'm often VERY WRONG!)

raise it up!: [info]linesfade on October 12th, 2007 01:45 am (UTC)
Oooooh... *loves you for this!*

ALL of those are questions that I would LOVE to have answered! I canNOT wait until the new season starts...I'm going crazy without new eps!! hehe

Thanks so much! Those little bits are WONDERFUL to know!

*skips off to watch the teaser*

XD
Jo: I like it to have teh scruff plz [lee][info]canadiangirl_86 on October 12th, 2007 02:40 am (UTC)
My pleasure. A bit frustrating to not have any answers to the questions but it sure is fun to play around with spec!
Elle[info]xbeyondinsanex on April 6th, 2008 07:42 pm (UTC)
Not sure if anyone's posted yet, but Katee said that Kara's only slept with one person up till episode 16, and it's Anders. From her lack of instant recall, I am thinking it happens pretty early on in the season.

BOO!
( 22 fell — fall off the wagon )